Perry Carpenter ran a deepfake test. One participant correctly flagged a video with a cloned voice as fake, then blamed glazed eyes and an odd shadow. Both were in the original footage. The answer was right. The reasoning was invented.
That gap between what we see and what we believe is where Perry works. As Chief Deception Strategist at KnowBe4, he studies how attackers exploit human behavior. He’s also the author of three books and host of the 8th Layer Insights podcast.
Perry and host Heidi explain why awareness alone never changes behavior, and why calling people the weakest link misses the point. They dig into the “happy valley,” an approach that gently guides users toward safe choices, and how attackers use that same principle to box people in and hide the way out. For builders, Perry’s advice is practical: make risky actions harder to take.
Perry’s advice is simple: make risky things harder to do, and give people permission to slow down.
Topics Covered
0:00 - Introduction
2:00 - What a chief deception strategist actually does
4:35 - From managing human risk to managing the human environment
6:40 - Why every con is built around managing attention
11:05 - Are regulated industries targets or collateral damage?
12:05 - Pig butchering, rug pulls, and the loneliness exploit
13:30 - How uncertainty leads to people choosing their own reality
16:15 - The problem with “human firewall” and “weakest link”
17:30 - Why awareness alone never changes behavior
19:50 - What makes an organization’s culture harder to fool
23:05 - The happy valley, dark patterns, and the attacker’s toolbox
26:05 - Content provenance, C2PA, and where it breaks down
31:00 - Why context shapes what people believe is fake
About Perry Carpenter
Perry Carpenter is a multi-award-winning author, podcaster, and speaker, with over two decades in cybersecurity focusing on how cybercriminals exploit human behavior. As the Chief Deception Strategist at KnowBe4, Perry helps build robust human-centric defenses against social engineering-based threats. His latest book, FAIK: A Practical Guide to Living in a World of Deepfakes, Disinformation, and AI-Generated Deceptions (Wiley: Oct 2024), explores AI’s role in deception. Perry also hosts the award-winning podcasts 8th Layer Insights and Digital Folklore.
• Connect with our guest Perry Carpenter: https://www.linkedin.com/in/perrycarpenter/
• Check out KnowBe4:
https://www.knowbe4.com/
• Grab Perry’s books from Amazon: https://www.amazon.com/stores/author/B07PY1CWM6
